saturn "vs link cable" (new pictures posted Nov 2n

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xDerekRx
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Postby xDerekRx » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:49 pm

MonkeyFist wrote:
xDerekRx wrote:And whoever said Hexen is better than Doom is drinking something strong! Doom is one of the best games ever created!


I implied that the saturn port of the game Doom (US) was rubbish, compared to other releases. Doom is indeed far superior than hexen (and it has sequels!)

Thanks for the info! Will have to focus on more japanese releases instead of relying on my library (will take more effort).


Ok in that respect you are correct :)

It upsets me, almost too much, that the Saturn has one of the worst ports of the game. Considering the system is my favorite and Doom is a Top 5 all time game. Not fair a system of that power had a rushed copy.

But like I mentioned the Japanese one was more polished and is actually all in English so I try to base my opinion on that version.

That said it would be cool to find out at least 1 saturn FPS has an official working link mode.
Netlink Games Owned:
-Duke Nukem 3D
-Sega Rally
-Bomberman
-Virtua On
-Daytona CCE Netlink Edition

If you wanna play just give me a holla!

Macabre
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Postby Macabre » Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:05 pm

Its really all give and take. Have you ever played wipeout on a ps1? After playing it on the Saturn it felt like a slug race (granted it was originally made for ps1, then ported to Saturn where it lost some weapon textures, but still, the Saturn version is far superior).


Update to this; I haven't had time to get any blank disc's yet, but I did receive my box sets in the mail (record time! I'm still waiting on some white LED's i got from japan like 3 weeks ago).

The only one I fiddled with tonight is Geobockers, which has its menu's in English so no need for translation just yet.

While I did post that link to the Steeldom download, I still can't find a download for Geobockers. This game is far from impressive enough to buy a second copy, but it still warrants a full test play. I've never actually made a backup of a game, is there any useful guides I can follow for taking this legit disc and making an iso to make a pair and also share?

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xDerekRx
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Postby xDerekRx » Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:48 am

I enjoyed Wipeout back in the day but never played the Saturn version (shame on me) Im guessing its cheap on Ebay so Ill have to grab 2 copies and check out the Link Cable mode.

I have yet to play Steeldom yet, looks like Virtua On, I only bought it for the Cable but then again it probably is worth at least one play.
Netlink Games Owned:
-Duke Nukem 3D
-Sega Rally
-Bomberman
-Virtua On
-Daytona CCE Netlink Edition

If you wanna play just give me a holla!

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Warp2063
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Postby Warp2063 » Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:57 pm

I think you can just pop the disc in a burner, set it to a low write speed like 4 or 8x, and hit copy. Assuming your system is modded, i think it will work. I can test that tonight, probably.

If you want to buy my Japanese copy of Doom, Derek, I'd be okay with that. I really only bought it because someone mentioned that somebody wanted it.
I have my Saturns, I have some of my games, I have a RasPi. Gotta put all this stuff together!

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xDerekRx
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Postby xDerekRx » Fri Oct 15, 2010 1:20 am

Excellent. I will PM you. I really want to check out the Link Cable mode. Ill credit you in the video.
Netlink Games Owned:
-Duke Nukem 3D
-Sega Rally
-Bomberman
-Virtua On
-Daytona CCE Netlink Edition

If you wanna play just give me a holla!

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Warp2063
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Postby Warp2063 » Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:21 pm

Forgot to do the test burn. I wrote myself a note this time, so I'll do it today.
I have my Saturns, I have some of my games, I have a RasPi. Gotta put all this stuff together!

Macabre
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Postby Macabre » Fri Oct 15, 2010 11:47 pm

More dreamcast link cable talk~

I pointed the mentioned poster (captin dreamcst) to that topic for more sharingness.



As for this topic, I'm enjoying steeldom vs play. I have a few iso and cdi 's waiting to be burnt, and I'm still tinkering with this stupid geobockers game (i refuse to buy a second copy of this...).



Noone has replied to my initial request for information regarding making a vs cable compilation disc. Does anyone know many other sites that I could go harass people / hire someone to help build this disc?




Also 100% off topic, I'm trading away a complete mint US dc bba, but slightly related to this site is what I'm looking for (a pair of black US saturn virtua sticks & wheels). If anyone is interested pm me~

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xDerekRx
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Postby xDerekRx » Fri Oct 15, 2010 11:54 pm

PMed
Netlink Games Owned:
-Duke Nukem 3D
-Sega Rally
-Bomberman
-Virtua On
-Daytona CCE Netlink Edition

If you wanna play just give me a holla!

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Warp2063
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Postby Warp2063 » Sat Oct 16, 2010 7:38 am

Sorry that it took me so long to get back on the CD burning thing. I ran the test last night, but couldn't get on to post 'til now.

I stuck my legitimate copy of Sega Rally Championship Plus Netlink Edition in my computer, booted up Nero, set the write speed to low, and hit "Copy". I also turned on simulation mode and disc verification, but I don't think those are necessary. A few minutes later, I had a disc. Took said disc, put it into one of my unmodded Saturns, performed a swap trick with another legit disc, swapped back to the copy, and on the first try, I was racing. No problems.

The Saturn discs are laid out pretty simply. The discs are standard CDs using a standard disc format. The information on the disc contains standard CD audio tracks followed by data tracks, and after that is the ring that the Saturn checks to make sure it's a legit disc. So Nero copies the CD audio and the data, and ignores the ring because it's past any actual information that it can read from the disc.



As for the "Compilation disc" for Dreamcast... I haven't responded because I don't know anything about compiling a Dreamcast disc or writing software for the Dreamcast. I don't think it would be all that difficult, because I doubt you'd have to change anything in the actual program... although you might have problems with some of that video data that some games have near the outside of the disc to read it faster. I don't know specifically who you could ask about it, but I remember that there was a group of people who would do a Saturn compilation each year... they'd all write homebrew games, and at the end, the best ones would be compiled on an ISO. Perhaps there are people who do the same thing for the Dreamcast?
I have my Saturns, I have some of my games, I have a RasPi. Gotta put all this stuff together!

Macabre
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Postby Macabre » Thu Oct 21, 2010 6:32 pm

I'm still fiddling with games.

GunGriffon II (2) actually comes with a box set that doesn't advertise the cable;

http://cgi.ebay.com/BOX-COLLECTOR-SATUR ... 3ef9f55225

Ignore that sellers price, I got mine for $30.


I really like the gungriffon games on ps2, this one is great! This is almost as much a reason to continue on this project as VO was!

I still can't find an .iso or .cdi of this or geobockers, am waiting for a response from a friend that might have information about making the compilation disc - in which case I might be sending all the legit copies of the games for a more precise selection of titles to rip (keeping all the formats the same).

If that fails I'll be attempting to upload like your suggesting. Iirc .iso is still the best format for manipulating software for programmers? It might have been .cdi's.. (all i really remember is that .nrg's are the devil)

Macabre
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Postby Macabre » Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:26 am

Ok, I've been a little side tracked by social life, but I'm still playing with this quite a bit!

Here are a pile of pictures showing off what I have, comparing cables & boxes, and some paperwork. If anyone has any experience reading japanese, please do share!

Here are the 3 box sets I've been able to find thus far, all including a cable each. The geobockers box set is possibly the first released box set including the cable (as its much larger in size). Being patient you can find these at DAMN low costs! I purchased Gungriffon II ~new~ off ebay for $25 + shipping, and didn't even see that it was a box set (stock photo just showed a jewel case), and was pleasantly surprised to find that it was a box set!

Here is the official sega cable (stand alone) & the unofficial cable. The official sega cable is the exact same one that is found in the box sets, while the unofficial cable has a different look to it.

What I mean by "look" is literally how they look. In that photo, there is an official saturn controller plug in the middle, with the unofficial plug to its left, and the official sega serial plug to its right. Oddly enough the unofficial one looks...better?

They all function exactly the same. I've been playing with two saturns back to back for a bit, and so far have not noticed any difference in either plug. I purposefully tested VO, as i recall reading that the dreamcast VOOT had link problems with unofficial link cables, which is actually due to the length of the unofficial cable & how VOOT works.

Here is a side viewp of the official sega (stand alone) cable box, with the back top, and the back bottom for possible translation.

The official stand alone cable also included this single paper inside the box.

Geobockers also included this one single page of paper.

Here are the back of the boxes of geobockers, steeldom, and also gun griffon II, which I would love to find a complete translation of...

Relating to;

This is an interesting picture, showing the back of the three disc cases. I found this same yellow box on the bottom of my Daytona USA circuit edition (japanese) box (the only version that works with the link cable).


I would suspect that sega would have incorporated some sort of logo (sort of like the Netlink saturn swirl, XBand logo) or some peripheral notice sign, on the back of a game that supports the link cable. I'm sure that alot of games won't even show this, like most of these games released outside of japan, but maybe there are more in the japanese library that have this we haven't considered yet.

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Postby Warp2063 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 11:24 am

Sega Sata-n Taisen Ke-buru

Sega Saturn Competition Cable

Well, the sides of the box were easy, as you see above. The rest... well, I'm sure I could get the gist of it if I take the time. Unfortunately, I won't have time until after work... and you'd probably get better translation results from someone who is fluent in the language.

off paper -
Shiyouzyou no gosyuui

Something of operation....

Yeah, someone who is fluent in Japanese should be doing this, not someone like me who only dabbles... ^^;;

Well, that first white page is one of those general care sheets. "Don't use the cable like this" and "do use the cable like this" warning sheets. Sounds like it talks about how to care for the plugs, etc. Optimal humidity and temperature levels.

gb paper is almost exactly the same, from a quick glance.

gg box mentions a vs. mode on the back.

img_0858 - next to the green dot on each of the cases it mentions the taisen cable, but it's too blurry to make out the rest. I assume it says "supported" or something to that effect.

That's just what I gleaned from a quick look. I can take more time after work.
I have my Saturns, I have some of my games, I have a RasPi. Gotta put all this stuff together!

rush6432
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Postby rush6432 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 5:52 pm

i did a ton of research on this a while back and ive got a copy of the euro version of doom and a few others.

i even got the pinouts for the cable and made an adaptor to allow the serial cable to link a console to a computer serial port and had a program tunneling the serial connection over the internet for internet play
seemed to work but i only tested it on a LAN and not actually the internet. worked fine. internet play might work but im not sure how much if any lag there will be.

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Xranger60
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Postby Xranger60 » Wed Nov 03, 2010 7:37 pm

rush6432 wrote:i did a ton of research on this a while back and ive got a copy of the euro version of doom and a few others.

i even got the pinouts for the cable and made an adaptor to allow the serial cable to link a console to a computer serial port and had a program tunneling the serial connection over the internet for internet play
seemed to work but i only tested it on a LAN and not actually the internet. worked fine. internet play might work but im not sure how much if any lag there will be.


This actually sounds really awesome. I'm curious to see how that would hold up over the internet, too.
Willing to play Bomberman, Duke Nukem 3d, Virtual On, Sega Rally. Send me a PM.

Macabre
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Postby Macabre » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:32 pm

Thats a great idea, but I don't think it would work 100% as fast as having two consoles next to each other would.

I think (i'm not certain on this at all), that when you do a vs link game, one console acts as a "host" for the game, and the other console just inputs its own information in the the "host."

If that's the case, then you would have to ground-up a server, 100% custom just for each game.

On top of that you would have to make a match-making system (with netlink you dial someone, with modem games you can see a server hosts an open game that one player is already in, ect). You would literally have to find a programmer to modify each game menu...and i'm having a hard enough time finding someone to make a simple compilation disc to put them all together...yikes.

I'm sure its possible to pull this off, which would be epic awesome, but it would require a massive amount of work per game. The end result i feel would still have a game connection with a slight delay, as the serial port on the back of the saturn is hardly designed to put out signals for a long distant detection.


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